Golden: 300 episodes later, On Second Thought uses familiar script for podcast success
We had no idea what we were doing.
The one thing we knew was to be us.
It’s why the "On Second Thought" podcast is still going strong 300 episodes later.
It didn’t happen overnight, but my brother Kirk Bohls and I had already laid the blueprint even if we didn’t fully grasp it at the time what hosting a podcast meant.
Truth be known, we had actually been doing our own version of a podcast for 15 years before the genre even existed. Episode No. 300 is online today, but an argument can be made that it’s actually No. 10,000.
Back in the day, the sports department was the newsroom’s version of a barbershop. Remember those old dudes talking about boxing history in Eddie Murphy’s classic "Coming to America"? Well, the Statesman writers would also loudly debate the hottest sports topics of the day in passionate, unapologetic fashion, sometimes to the point where journalists in other departments would either don a pair of headphones to block out the clatter or actually walk over and join in.
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From those conversations, gold was born. It was organic copy that would be used in a Bohls' weekly Nine Things and One Crazy Prediction column or one of my Golden’s Nuggets or one of our colleague Olin Buchanan’s signature list series. At its best, a meaty enterprise piece would emerge from these discussions.
Even then, we were doing our version of a podcast and didn’t even know it.
Kinda how it all started: sports department debates
Some of the best columns have been a product of a simple question that morphed into a debate for the ages. Once, about 20 years ago, Olin and our former colleague Matthew Obernauer were debating the best first-round draft picks, by selection, of all time. When it got to No. 11, Olin, a lifelong Dallas Cowboys fan, said “It has to be Michael Irvin.”
“Irvin was good, but Frank Gifford was way better,” Obernauer retorted.
A mini verbal brouhaha erupted while the rest of us giggled with glee. The passion of two friends engaging in a spirited sports debate was something that happened all the time in our department. We were passionate about our craft and that passion usually found its way onto the pages of the paper.
Spring ahead a decade later, and sports podcasts began to crop up all over the place. Some of the best sportswriters in the state were taking a swing at the new toy. Houston Chronicle columnist Jerome Solomon had a successful pod. The Dallas Morning News' Kevin Sherrington was doing one with colleagues Evan Grant and David Moore.
After appearing as a guest on the Dallas show a couple of times in 2015, Kirk and I were at lunch and he looked at me and said, “If those dudes can do a podcast, we can too.”
“We’re funnier,” I said.
After all, we had already recorded dozens of videos over the years where we hit on dozens of hot sports topics, be it about the Longhorns or pro sports. We would also occasionally dip our toes into pop culture. By then, the Statesman already had a podcast called Statesman Shots, so it wasn’t a stretch that me and the Duck could do something similar. Something better.
We went back-and-forth on names before settling on a Bohls selection: On Second Thought.
Who knew there would be several dozen others by the same name that would pop up over the next seven years, but we went with it.
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Our first one dropped on Feb. 25, 2016. Embattled Texas football coach Charlie Strong was two losing seasons in and was facing the possibility of being deposed in Kentucky in the divorce case of a woman he knew while he was the head coach at Louisville.
From there, we were off and running. Or colleagues Brian Davis and Danny Davis were our third and fourth Beatles for many years while also hosting our other podcast, "Longhorn Confidential."
The early days were trial by error. The sound quality was hit-and-miss early because we were too dependent on our cell phones signals at first, but the addition of a state-of-the-art radio studio just outside the newsroom in 2019 — complete with a an awesome land line — turned out to be a game changer.
Mistakes did happen while trying to master the soundboard and software. One day we did a 30-minute segment with Oklahoman columnist Berry Tramel and the idiot writing this actually forgot to hit the Record button. Berry graciously agreed to do the interview all over again.
Amazing guests have defined the pod
The late billionaire T. Boone Pickens sent us into a viral orbit our first year when he made comments in Episode 28 of his deteriorating relationship with Oklahoma State football coach Mike Gundy. Weeks later, ESPN "College GameDay" personality Kirk Herbstreit came on to explain why he used the word "cesspool" in describing the culture surrounding Texas football. Another viral sensation.
We gained a great following due to the built-in audience — Texas football moves the needle — and great content due to the wonderful connections Kirk made with other media types over his many years in the business. We don't have a fancy assistant to set up interviews for us, that is, if you're not counting Siri. We've reached out to them ourselves over the years. Still do. Kirk has more administrators and coaches in his phone than a Fortune 500 CEO. My 20-plus years around UT sports has allowed me to amass a pretty sizable list of former players' numbers as well.
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The guests have made this thing sing.
We have tabbed broadcast legends like Verne Lundquist, Jim Nantz, Bill Schoening, Brad Sham, Craig Way, David Feherty, Dick Vitale and Brent Musberger and as the years passed were able to visit with current stars like Jay Bilas, Rece Davis, Holly Rowe, Adrian Wojnarowski, Jake Trotter, Joe Tessitore, Kris Budden, Herbstreit and Paul Finebaum, who blew the lid off Episode 271 — his third appearance — when he revealed that Alabama coach Nick Saban came really close to taking the Texas job in 2013.
Since we work in a Big 12 market, we made sure to always include then-commissioner Bob Bowlsby and some of the brightest journalistic minds in the conference or head coaches preparing to face Texas while sharing the studio with coworkers like Suzanne Halliburton, Catarino Vasquez, the Davis boys, "Slick" Rick Cantu, Ryan Autullo, Kevin Lyttle, Mike Craven and others. Even Statesman food critic Matthew Odam stopped by a time or two to discuss his beloved Houston Astros.
Longhorns sports legends have always been part of the fabric. We chatted it up with football icons like Earl Campbell, Mack Brown, Roy Williams, Rod Babers, Johnnie Johnson, Derrick Johnson, Brian Jones, Jordan Shipley, Aaron Ross, Sam Acho, Cory Redding, Michael Griffin and two-sport star Eric Metcalf.
In 2016, pitching great Huston Street took time out at the Dell Match Play to give his reflections on the death of his coach and mentor, Augie Garrido. Five years later, we brought together 2005 national champions Drew Stubbs, Buck Cody, Kyle McCulloch and Seth Johnston to give their favorite Augie memories and share what they saw in the 2021 team that was in the midst of a playoff run that would result in a trip to the College World Series.
And just this past January, the cream of the crop — Keith Moreland, Greg Swindell and Brooks Kieschnick — gave their favorite memories of coaching legend Cliff Gustafson, who had just passed.
We shared in celebrating incomparable softball pitcher Cat Osterman a year earlier when she logged in on Zoom to discuss her No. 8 jersey finally being retired. Golf legend Tom Kite called in during our second year to give his perspective on Dell Match Play settling in to a nice groove in Austin. Swimming legend Eddie Reese stopped by in April of 2021 to tell us why he retired then promptly unretired a few weeks later.
Athletic director Chris Del Conte has visited three times during his tenure. The legendary DeLoss Dodds called in to discuss his illustrious career and life in retirement.
We also landed great coaches who sometimes made life miserable for the Longhorns. Big names like Barry Switzer — who stood outside an important meeting in OKC to visit with us for 20 minutes before he simply couldn’t stay any longer — and fellow Sooners legend Bob Stoops, plus Bill Snyder, Mike Gundy and the late Mike Leach were always willing to be a part of the show.
We even have a future basketball Hall of Fame member on our friends list — Austinite Chris Bosh — who popped in back in 2021 to promote a book he wrote.
Great guests notwithstanding, being in multimedia can also be humbling. I’ll never forget running into a young man at Barton Creek Mall five years ago and he was so complimentary of the podcast. He could not have been more than 25.
“Thanks for listening and thanks for reading my column,” I said, extending my hand in the checkout line.
“You write a column?” he asked.
“Uh, yeah, I have since 2006,” I answered, trying to hide my shock.
“Wow, that’s cool,” he said. “I may check it out sometime. Keep those good podcasts coming.”
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It takes all types. We’re grateful for every listener who appreciates that we’ve done the show in good humor but haven’t ignored uncomfortable topics, from Baylor’s explosive sexual assault scandal to athletes reacting to police brutality aimed at people of color to the controversy surrounding "The Eyes of Texas" to former basketball coach Chris Beard’s arrest of domestic abuse charges and his ultimate dismissal.
Through it all, we have informed, debated, entertained and hopefully inspired some healthy discussion at the water cooler after listeners clicked off.
“The podcast has been one of my favorite things to do each week, “ Bohls told me Tuesday. “It gives us a chance to almost speak directly to some of our readers and expand our audience. And it's been a hoot having such cool conversations with the Who's Who of sports.”
None of this would have happened without great support from our Statesman leadership and our marketing/advertising departments — huge shoutout to longtime sponsor Bud Light — and producers like Alyssa Vidales, Adam Fish, and current superstar Chandler Hoefle, who was so dedicated that he came to my house in 2020 to set up a home studio in the middle of a pandemic.
“It’s been a blast, and I can't wait to see who will join us in our next 300 pods,” Bohls said.
We love to bring you our unique perspective in written form several times a week, but "On Second Thought" has been a real joy because it allows us to express ourselves in a different format while still being us. So please accept our sincere appreciation. Thanks for tuning in to make it a great success for these last seven years.
Join us in raising a glass to 300 wonderful episodes and many more to come.
Cheers.
The On Second Thought podcast posts every Thursday morning on statesman.com and all major podcast sites.
Our most memorable podcasts
David Feherty: The golf analyst was promoting his standup comedy act — and was describing the day his doctor told him he needed to address his drinking problem after Feherty told him he was was drinking two bottles of whiskey a day. Feherty said he didn’t need help. “I can drink it all by myself,” he said. Now that’s comedy.
Mack Brown: The Texas coaching legend was inducted into the College Football Hall of Fame and reflected on that night in 2006 when the Longhorns beat the top-ranked USC Trojans for the national championship.
Remembering Coach Gus: In January, Longhorns baseball greats Keith Moreland, Greg Swindell and Brooks Kieschnick shared their best memories of coaching legend Cliff Gustafson days after he died. They all agreed on one thing: Gustafson not only taught them how to play baseball, but how to be men.
Finebaum on Saban: Days before Texas and Alabama met for the first time since the Tide beat the Horns in the 2009 title game, acclaimed ESPN commentator Paul Finebaum revealed that Nick Saban came really close to taking the Texas coaching job in 2013 despite Saban publicly saying he hadn't spoken to Texas at the time.
Cat Osterman: In January 2020, Longhorns softball legend Cat Osterman basked in the afterglow of the news that her jersey was getting retired. Osterman had long campaigned to have her No. 8 immortalized despite resistance from the women’s athletic department. She was the third woman in school history to experience the honor.
T. Boone Pickens: During the first year of the podcast, the eccentric billionaire and Oklahoma State benefactor revealed that he and Mike Gundy’s relationship had deteriorated to the point where the football coach was “writing notes about me” to others. The conversation caused an uproar in Stillwater and beyond. Pickens, now deceased, declined a later request to appear on the podcast. “You guys got me in trouble,” he told Kirk Bohls.
This article originally appeared on Austin American-Statesman: Statesman podcast On Second Thought celebrates Episode 300
