Slovenia’s Jerman wins bumpy Bormio downhill

You have to have a will to win. It helps to put alot of time in going down the courses. Some coaching helps but you can be over coached. Racing should be fun first and have the drive to win and improve. My father skied up to his 83 birthday until cancer sided tracked him. He was a great skiier and the whole family raced. We were given skiis and had the ski hills to ski all the time we wanted. I loved racing it was a family thing growing up on the slopes. New skiis every year helps you to keep up with the other racers.

You have to have a will to win. It helps to put alot of time in going down the courses. Some coaching helps but you can be over coached. Racing should be fun first and have the drive to win and improve. My father skied up to his 83 birthday until cancer sided tracked him. He was a great skiier and the whole family raced. We were given skiis and had the ski hills to ski all the time we wanted. I loved racing it was a family thing growing up on the slopes. New skiis every year helps you to keep up with the other racers.

You have to have a will to win. It helps to put alot of time in going down the courses. Some coaching helps but you can be over coached. Racing should be fun first and have the drive to win and improve. My father skied up to his 83 birthday until cancer sided tracked him. He was a great skiier and the whole family raced. We were given skiis and had the ski hills to ski all the time we wanted. I loved racing it was a family thing growing up on the slopes. New skiis every year helps you to keep up with the other racers.

You have to have a will to win. It helps to put alot of time in going down the courses. Some coaching helps but you can be over coached. Racing should be fun first and have the drive to win and improve. My father skied up to his 83 birthday until cancer sided tracked him. He was a great skiier and the whole family raced. We were given skiis and had the ski hills to ski all the time we wanted. I loved racing it was a family thing growing up on the slopes. New skiis every year helps you to keep up with the other racers.

Yup- I see what you mean, Greg.
Cheers
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Nastar medals and racing seniors in America are a far cry from world cup racing. I'm sorry that is offensive but those are great accomplishments and you should be proud of them. Like I said before, it's virtually imposible to anaylize without real experience. I couldn't disagree more with parkandrider about wreckless skiing turned to recovery is how the greatest skiers of all time won races. Flailing skiers can not stay on line and they will get injured. Many of the greatest skiers never reached their goals due to little mistakes that permanently maimed them. That is sad. Killy, Stenmark, Thoeni, Ghiradelli, Mair, Kjus, Zurbibriggen, Arnold, Nindl, Duvillard, Penz, Augert, Russel, to mention a few of the all time greatest were the very best technicians. They did not achieve those levels and sustain for years by mistake and recovery skiing. The crucial mistakes they made were regrettable and ended their careers prematurely. And when we refer to balls, we develop those young. If you started racing when you are older I could see that fear is something you might have to work at over coming. Years ago, I was training in Italy in September. The junior racing program that was present was impressive. They skiied so fast and so technical and on line. Their coaches didn't stop them at the bottom to chit chat , they yelled attack. These kids were so much faster than our juniors and our seniors it's no wonder they have been leagues ahead in overall victories. Marc Ghiradelli's dad knew the importantance of not letting goof balls coach his kid! Killy quit the team because of lame coaches. Lame coaches on the USST have destroyed more great skiers by making slalom skiers race downhills in Europe than you kids could imagine. Back to our development ymca ski programs in America. I recently called Mammoth Mtn. race dept. They have over 300 kids enrolled in the program. They have not developed 1 male ski racer that has made the the USST A squad in over 40 years. So the USST hired the head of the program (Dennis Agee) some years ago to coach the women. His track record for developing skiers to the international level spoke for itself. Like I said before, don't be offended and start name calling because of your lack of experience, the ymca approach is great for the ones that can afford the expensive programs and these programs are great steps for kids to enjoy the outdoors and exercise but they are a far cry from preparing them to compete against the Europeans. I am extremely impressed with kids that have grown up in America and competed in Europe.They are all very special to have made it through the bogged down Corporate system. I suggest to Greg and Parkinrider to hop on an airplane and find a job with the USST carrying parkas or gate keeping so you can get up as close as you can and watch closely for several years and I guarantee you will learn a tremendous amount . You will be able to see up close the real danger of technical mistakes and line and how devastating to see a career ending abruptly.

Park.....I am surprised you waste your time addressing Patricia anymore. She is a complete LOON!

No doubt- Patricia is right about " Back seat" and "Park n Ride" skiing. It is being addressed by USSA and ski race coaching has taken a whole new turn as a result of the new dynamics offered by the shape ski. Patricia's comments are about 6 years behind the curve. As for injuries- bummer when it happens, but the injury rate among WC racers is about the same that it was on "straight" skis, just different types and reported more often - sometimes with agonizing clarity- see youtube. We have progressively move from leg fractures to ACL tears over the last 2 decades- that's one example. As for skis "not taking much talent"- ever seen the new FIS standard specs on a men's GS ski? 183 cm min plus a 27m turn rad min, and a 55mm stand height restriction. That's a plank unless you go at 30mph plus. And- btw snow fencing is little wood slats that keep the snow from blowing onto the piste. B net and A net are used to line race courses.

Patricias comments on technique are a moot point. Technique is always paramount in skiing. All Good ski racers have good technique- or good enough. It's when you combine good technique with good tactics that you get top notch results- and enter the danger zone too I have seen plenty of racers with good technique and no cajones to apply it to the gutsy tactics it takes to win. And in most cases on a race course if you want to win- it aint pretty. No style points- you win because you threw the limited biomechanics of the human body into the unlimited forces and dynamics of a ski turn. Every great ski race result will involve a mistake followed by a recovery. That's what happens when you push the limits of your abilities. You can count on injury among the best of the best too. Marc Ghirardelli had 13 knee surguries. He won the WC overall title 5 times. Aksel Lund Svindal slice open his body on a training run 2 seasons ago in Beaver Creek DH training. He won the WC overall title last year. Patricia- if you want to mother-hen athletes, get them to switch to shuffle board- or curling- or ice dancing- maybe world championship poker.

Perfect technique is a necessity to keep racers out of snow fences. It matters not what shape or size of the athelete. If any of the analyists could actually ride these high performance skiis down a world track at the speed of World Cup skiers, they would begin to understand how critical technique is. The problem with the new skiis is that they are so good that it doesn't take talent to ride them. Yet, when you put super talented disciplined atheletes on these skiis they are flat out explosive and there is no time for back seat hand dragging. Watch and anaylize closely what sends kids into the fences.Turn off the volume so you are not influenced by the announcers. The days of Franz Klammer runs is over!!!!!

He/she who gets to the bottom first wins, right ??? Technique.... if we were all built out the very same cookie cutter mold and the exact same skill sets then teaching perfect "technique" would be just fine. A good coach can obviously pick out a skiers strong points and teach them to exploit their God given talents and of course some racers are naturally more talented than others. (Bode,Maier,Vonn to name a few.) Repetition........ run after run after run after run after run. Anyways...... babbling on now.

Practice runs are always fun, and you know 29th in the world isn't all that bad!!

Hey Patricia.....Bode finished second in the final training run for the Downhill at Lake Louise. What do you have to say now oh wise learned one?

"By the way ski areas don't hire racing coaches, they hire ski enthusiasts whom pay the ski school for little racing teaching certificates. " WTF??? What freaking planet are you from? Or maybe you just write fiction novels for a living?? Have a nice life. Geeez!

Greg, the record is 403 to 98 overall world cup victories. Austria by 4 times over the US. I agree there are lots of coaches that are actively coaching whom have ski racing background that have gone to ski school clinics to get certified. Does that make them qualified to teach? Sure, but junior programs throughout the nation are clones of American ski school techniques. Now if the coaches follow their supervisors ymca approach they will talk the kids into boredum eventually abandoning racing and off to the parks. This works great for corporate ski schools because the general public will pay to come back tomorrow for more lectures (standing in groups clogging ski runs everywhere) because they are still waiting to learn how to ski..Repeat customers$$$$!!!!! Now ski racing is quite different from day 1. Technique is critical so whether your coaches are ski instructors or ex nastar or ex junior racers they are clueless of what these skiis and boot combos will do to you at' world speed' These flapping arm programs have gotten more kids hurt in the development programs and destroyed some of the greatest American skiers before they ever had a chance. US ski team coaches forcing young slalom specialists to race downhill in Europe. If you want names there are plenty!!! Now regarding the Mahres. I agree they were nw hacks but twins are unique. They had each other and their bodies and minds think similar. I discussed this with Phil at a pre race meeting for our kids whom were racing in the event. I commended him on his incredible improvement and how he skiied the slalom perfect in the Olympics. He graciously thanked me while we waited for him to be called up as the guest speaker. The coaches talked incessantly about their knowledge and the event never calling on the former gold medalists to share his experience. What a waste!!! Now, Why should we have to bring up the girls? Girls love boys and boys love girls. Boys can go extremely fast with good technique or not. Girls are not stupid and boys like to teach. Seriously, girls have very fast examples if they are lucky enough to follow one with good technique they can go fast too. I don't know Ted but he is an attacker and very smart to have figured it out. I'm sure someone helped him or he is a good video anaylist. Regarding 1st hand, when I met Jean Claude Killy he stated,"If you ski anything like your brother, I sure don't want to have to race you....By the way ski areas don't hire racing coaches, they hire ski enthusiasts whom pay the ski school for little racing teaching certificates. If you pay enough and get enough certificates then you are licensed to be a race coach. Thats neat and wonderful but little juniors continue to go through programs flapping themselves off of race tracks throughout America.

And Patricia......Bode did his own thing because he was not willing to go by the rules the Ski Team had at the time.

The more I read what you write.......the more I wonder if you really know what you are talking about first hand. Maybe you need to quit reading books and listening to hearsay and get out there and coach or help out with your local ski RACE team yourself. Your descriptions of what happens in ski race programs could not be further from the truth.

Patricia.....I am becoming a bit alarmed by your attitude here. You seem to have general ski schools pegged pretty well. But, EVERY ski race team I have been a part of the coaching staff was made up primarily of ski race coaches. Not instructors masquerading as such...but certified racing specialists. Most of these were former racers themselves.

I would also say that you do not seem to know there Mahre's very well then. I spent dozens of hours with them and when Phil himself says he was not technically pure, I will let that speak for itself.

You seem to think that Americans are incapable of coaching and developing winning ski racers, yet you have said nothing about Lindsay Vonn, Ted Ligerty, or Julia Mancuso. All of whom win, or are capable of winning at anytime. Ligety, and Vonn are very clean technique wise. So enlighten me as to what your beef is. You sure sound a lot like an Austrian snob to me.

Park.......as to your last post.....Micro brews sounds GREAT to me!

The certification ski school techniques took over ski racing in the 70's. Ski schools for the public make money. Ski racing doesn't make money for ski resorts therefor ski racing america is run by a bunch of ski instructors with lots of certification cards (revamped or not).This makes sense from the corporate view but has virtually destroyed the hopes and the potential of the greatest young skiers in America. Their system relies heavey on lectures on the slopes, icing the public and more dangerously young ski racers waiting to attack training courses while there muscles grow cold. So the rich can send their kids to a private academy where there might be a qualified coach while the rest ski off to the parks. Now as for the Mahres. Phil was extremely technical and did not win leaning. Maybe Harold fixed him but he skiied nearly perfect when winning and Steve was figuring it out in the end. Bode is extremely talented and when he was winning he wasn't flapping. Again the equipment has no patience for any kind of flappin or leaning. Perfect technique is mandatory whether you are long or short, you can not drag your left arm behind you. This is why ski instructors can not take our young skiers and bring them to a world class level. They can't understand what they can't experience. Bode, The Mahres, Tommy Moe are freaks (very special atheletes ) whom figured out not to listen to goof balls and weaved through to victory. Did you ever wonder why Bode did his own thing???

OK- Greg. Don't get too worked up over what I am saying. As far as ski-race technique the Mahres are history and Bode is almost a foregone conclusion. I'm talking about some commonalities -bad ones- in movement patterns that need to be corrected. Just as everyone has different biomechanics (like endo, meso, and ecotmorphic are body types), everyone will have some kind of quirkiness. Is the quirkiness functional enough to help them go faster in the race course? Cool - then roll with it. Does it hinder the athlete? Then modify or do away with it.

Greg- commonalities for instance - we have a whole new crop of racers out there who never even heard of a straight ski. Shape skis turn so easily when edged that we have a new trend developing called park-and-ride (instead of progressive edging). This is one of many common movement patterns developing and it's not good. In this case, our little racer rockets are throwing skis edge and hanging on for the ride. This is one of many syndromes that USSA coaches are trying to address at the J5 level. And this is just within the realm of ski technique. My point to Patricia is that her concerns about teaching kids early is being addressed at an early age and not just in the area of ski technique.

Hope this helps, but it's really the kind of discussion that sucks on a computer, but works best over several sessions face to face and with many micro-brews.

Cheers
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Patricia and Parkinator.....I want to respond to what you are saying.

Is Bode text book? Not at all. But he has achieved the success he has doing it his way. He has won TWO World Cup overalls so it is not like he is not winning against the Europeans. He is also not the first to have quirks in his skiing style. Phil and Steve Mahre both had what can only be described as the "White Pass Lean". It was not text book at all and many coaches attempted to get it out of their skiing. Harold Schoenaar was the first coach to look at them and build on what they did, not remove it. By working with them, he was able to help them become the successes they both were. In my race days I was also not text book in any way. I was frustrated by much of the "coaching" I received. I did not get coaching that really helped me until I worked with Phil and Steve because they understood what it meant to be unorthodox, and how to take what you do and make it better. It made all the difference to me. I then lucked out and found a coach who could work with me on a regular basis that also understood that. I had a fair amount of success after that.

What I am saying is that while it is good to have coaches go through a certification process, it may not be a good thing to have them all believing there is just one proper way to ski. That is not true, and many a great skier could be missed out on if coaches are not flexible enough to be able to work with individuality.

patricia- USSA recognizes your concerns. If you have been following what they have been doing over the last several years- the coaching certification and continuing ed have been entirely revamped.

I didn't get to see Bode ski the slalom but I have watched his deterioation through the years. His arms have been a disaster for years. I don't understand why he could not correct his problems in this modern era of video. You don't need a coach so I hope the us ski team has hired some one that has a clue or shoot video of him so he could figure it out. This sport is so technical and the skiis/boots demand perfect technique to be successful. Just take a look at the Austrians through the years. They don't send there kids down the slopes flailing for years. They teach them early. Our American programs are like ymca comparativly. We have unqualified teachers from very early stages all the way through the ski team . This is not a new problem. It does not impress me when an American whoops americans by seconds. The problem is, it is generally too late by the time kids make the us ski team to teach technique. Bode is very talented and I hope someone can help him because racing is dangerous and you only have a couple o f minutes a week to get it together.

grob12541 thats an awesome ski resume man, wish I could have gotten even close to that as I had a lot of fun racing. congrats to you! and yes some race series do have handicaps like ASRA. I agree that Bode is talented and unpredictable and should be a fun Olympics. Just didnt like the quick criticism that was obviously not thought out! I dont think Bode is expecting to hit podiums early on and I dont think its his main concern. I think he is pacing himself for what will be a grueling schedule. Only time I saw Bode was when he was skiing for Carabasset academy. He blew people away in GS and slalom by SECONDS per run.

Handicap in Masters Racing? Not that I remember. I do remember handicaps in NASTAR though.

Bode is going to struggle, especially in the early races. You can't just walk back on to the WC and hit podiums. Mr. is right about this. But.....this guy is possessed of talent few of us can dream of. Will he redeem himself at Vancouver? Only time will tell for sure. But, the fact that he made the second run on his first race back speaks volumes about him.

I remember the first time I ever saw Bode. He showed up at Mt. Bachelor at the JO's on a pair of K2 Fours, and won EVERYTHING! By huge margins.

And if we are going to discuss resumes....(as if it really matters)........PNSA Masters Giant Slalom and Super G champion in 1988 - 1990. PNSA combined Bronze Medalist for the 1989 season. Total of 15 races won from 1984-1991 at the USSA level in three different regions, not to mention more NASTAR Medals than I can even count. Trained with the US Ski Team at Mt. Bachelor from 1985 - 1991. Helped Salomon develop their ski line as a tester before they ever were available. Sponsored by Tecnica, Marker, Blizzard, and Rossignol during my Race Days. Also received coaching from Phil and Steve Mahre. Oh yes.....and for good measure, drafted out of High School by the Oakland A's.

Mr I only did a few masters races and ASRA in the northeast about ten years ago with a best handicap around 7 before blowing my ACL so you may be a better racer but I am also more of a backcountry guy myself. I apologize if you truly are an accomplished racer with my armchair athlete copmment. My criticism of your blog was because I didnt think your critique of Bode was fair and my intention was to defend him. Obviously you dont understand competition at the highest levels because it is hard to sustain 100% peak performance for several months especially when you get into your 30s. Your reference to Lance exposes the weakness in your arguments. He only focuses on the TDF and he does have many months and thousands of miles before the TOUR. However what your argument is lacking is that when he does his first races of the year usally the Tour of California, Georgia or the tour down under he only has a few weeks of training. He doesnt intent to contend and he is usually a few pounds overweight. His goal is to keep conditioning and peak at the tour. SO...................Mr. It MAY BE POSSIBLE that BODE is not focusing on the overall as much as winning Olympic medals this year. Skiing all 4 disciplines is not easy as you know and so he may be trying to time his performance for Vancouver. Bode is also a lot savier than people give him credit for as you well know because he was one of the first racers to take advantage of shaped ski technology which was a large influence for his style of sitting closer on his tails. As for knowing sports at the highest level I can cite several examples. I am a +.8 handicap former NCAA D1 golfer and have played in 3 US golf amateurs and several Nationwide tour events. Also before the ACL I was a triathlete with an Olympic distance PR of 2hrs:02min with an average bike TT of 28mph.

I watched Bode's runs Steve O. Don't get me wrong, Bode has more natural talent than most but he didn't look so sharp. I know, Bodes technique isn't necessarily sharp and smooth but his timing was off. Obviously you don't understand the need or purpose of conditioning ESPECIALLY when you ski all 4 disciplines. Did Lance Armstrong come out of retirement and train for a month before he started racing again? I don't think so...... As for my skiing back ground maybe I'll see you at the next masters race. What's your handicap by the way ??