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Tue Sep 02, 2008 1:55 pm EDT

Debating Sidney Crosby's wingers and the Penguins' Cup chances

By Greg Wyshynski

Whether or not you're a Pittsburgh Penguins fan doesn't matter: Tony Ferrante of The Confluence of the Three Rivers put together a must-read roundtable discussion with an elite group of guests (including our own Sean Leahy, Seth Rorabaugh of Empty Netters, Hooks Orpik of The Sweater Ted and the Penguins' own director of content and publications Joe Sager) to preview the 2008-09 Penguins. I hope other blogs in NHL cities take note and repeat the idea. It's killer.

Two questions in particular were rather revelatory. The first involved which players could (or will) play on a line with Sidney Crosby this season. The clear consensus is that Miroslav Satan will be one of the wingers; then you have those who suggest fellow UFA acquisition Ruslan Fedotenko, Pascal Dupuis (who didn't exactly shine during stretches last season), the gritty Matt Cooke, Malkin's wing man Petr Sykora and Janne Pesonen, a quantity that's rather unknown outside of his very shiny helmet.

One name that sticks out as a possibility: Jordan Staal. Blogger Chris Yarbrough believes a Staal/Crosby/Satan line could be one of the top three in hockey as far as offense and defense goes, and if Miro flourishes with Sidney that's not all that improbable. If nothing else, pairing Staal with Crosby could quickly snap him out of his offensive funk if it carries over to 2008-09 ... although a huge numbers year might make that RFA contract negotiation a little dicier.

The second topic that just stunned me was when the bloggers made their season predictions. My feelings on the Penguins' chances following their finals' defeat have been established, and thoroughly debated. What I didn't count on was that Penguins fans would allow excusable homerism to cloud an inexcusable disregard for reality.

Eight of the 10 respondents referred to the Penguins as the team to beat in the East; five of them went as far as to predict the Penguins will win the Stanley Cup this season.

Only Chris Wassel -- who was kind enough to have me as a guest on The NHL Arena Podcast this weekend (.mp3) -- had the appropriate response to the Penguins' potential chances:

The Penguins are going to have a hangover similar to Edmonton and Ottawa (Runner-ups in 2006 and 2007 respectively).  This is where having Ty Conklin would have helped some.  However, Marc-Andre Fleury is going to have to play extremely well early with the loss of Ryan Whitney.  I can see Pittsburgh being close to .500 before Whitney comes back around Christmas or so.  After that, they will likely go on a streak and get just enough points to grab a 6th or 7th seed in the East (97 points).  In the playoffs, they can definitely win a round or two if the matchups are right.

Isn't this the most likely scenario for the Penguins this season?

Again, the whole thing is worth a read, especially the part where Leahy makes the case that the Detroit Red Wings didn't "have too many players considered ‘tough guys'" last season. Wherever he is, I think Darren McCarty just smashed something.

Related: Hockey Fans, Crosby vs. Ovechkin vs. Malkin

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136 Comments

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  1. lunchbox
    1. Posted by lunchbox Thu Sep 03, 2009 3:20 pm EDT

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    let me throw this out there we lost 2 scorers and picked up 3 now none of them are at the talent level of hossa but id easily say if you put fedetenko on the line with malkin and sykora that he could score just as many if not more goals than malone did. i think the pens are actually deeper than they were last year with even the 4th line having more scoring prowess than we did last year. and the fact of the matter is if we stay healthy we will win the division philly has done nothing to improve, ny has actuially gotten worse by losing two guys that were great, the islanders are laughable and the devils well other than brodour bailing them out on some games they have no chance.
    ill ask you about a fa that left us last year that seemed to be very good in our system but has done nothing with the lighting. remember micheal oullet? yeah cause most everyone else doesnt. this team will be good. and Wyshynski stop hating on the pens and you suck
  2. 5 4 fighting
    2. Posted by 5 4 fighting Thu Sep 03, 2009 4:01 pm EDT

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    I have seen Fedetenko play with gifted players before in Lecavalier/StLouis and Richards-why should this result in anything different? He will score his 15-20 goals and thats it. Satan is a gifted offensive player who will score at the 50+ points regardless, just don't ask too much in his own zone and Dupuis LOL. You lost more than you gained-good luck,looking at a 5th -6th place finish.
  3. the.starterwife
    3. Posted by the.starterwife Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:02 pm EDT

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    Pens bloggers are homers? You don't say. They're the only group who might be more homer-erotic than Steelers fans.
  4. the.starterwife
    4. Posted by the.starterwife Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:02 pm EDT

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    Pens bloggers are homers? You don't say. They're the only group who might be more homer-erotic than Steelers fans.
  5. Wilf
    5. Posted by Wilf Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:46 pm EDT

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    "inexcusable disregard for reality?" Who has gotten better in the East since the end of this year to make you think the gap in the Eastern Conference has gotten smaller between everybody else and a Penguin team that lost exactly two playoff games to Eastern teams? Everybody's got net gains and losses.
    Greg's reacting too hard to the charge that he's pro-Penguins. I mean, hell, think how much harder your job would be, Wysh, if you couldn't write about the Penguins and the funny online stuff their fanbase does.
  6. Kevin K
    6. Posted by Kevin K Thu Sep 03, 2009 3:36 pm EDT

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    I think the Pens will have a good season, not great like last year but good. I'd say playoffs are a good possibility. The playoffs are not a lock for anybody except a few teams. I worry the long season and very short offseason will hinder the Pens abit but I still see them in the playoffs.
  7. .................................................!
    7. Posted by .................................................! Thu Sep 03, 2009 2:44 pm EDT

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    I hate the Pens with every bone in my body, but Malkin/Crosby/Staal down the middle makes the wingers irrelevant. They aren't the juggernaut they would have been had they kept the roster intact, but they're a lock for the playoffs. Edmonton and Ottawa were severely flawed teams; the Pens core is still elite.
    Come playoff time, that experience might be enough to carry them through the East. But my homerism tells me it's the Caps' year.
  8. JeremyPitt
    8. Posted by JeremyPitt Thu Sep 03, 2009 3:34 pm EDT

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    I think the Pens will make the palyoffs. I'm sure there will be that hangover effect as well. The thought of Stahl on Crosby's wing makes a lot of sense. I expect to see Satan on the other side. My prediction: Pens start slowly, but get better as season goes on. They'll hit their stride in late March, & take a 3 or 4 seed into the playoffs. One intangible: as the new arena takes shape, there will be a lot of excitement. The team & fans see more light at the end of the tunnel.. plus they have their core locked in. Shero has done an outstanding job.
  9. Orpik's Free Candy
    9. Posted by Orpik's Free Candy Thu Sep 03, 2009 8:57 pm EDT

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    The Pens have a really good chance at making the final this season if they don't let the loss get to them they still have their core players (Crosby, Malkin, Fleury, Gonchar, & Whitney (even though he's hurt) ) plus others that will be key in the season (Satan) we still have a good team as long as the loss of The Cup doesn't get to the players.
    LETS GO PENS!!!
  10. Loser Chris
    10. Posted by Loser Chris Thu Sep 03, 2009 3:33 pm EDT

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    "The Penguins breezed through the East in last season’s playoffs and I don’t think any team in the East, Pens included, did much to markedly improve themselves this offseason (except for Tampa, but they still have no defense). Because of that, despite my gut, I have a hard time not picking the Penguins to return to the Finals. The road will be harder this season, and a lot could change between now and April, but as it stands I do not see a team in the East who I think would likely beat the Pens in a seven game series."
    Where's the "disregard for reality" there? None of the contenders in the East (Penguins or otherwise) did anything to make a significant upgrade. Most teams pretty much stood firm as pieces reshuffled a bit, and that leaves the Pens as the team to beat in the East.
  11. Wyshynski
    11. Posted by Wyshynski Thu Sep 03, 2009 8:21 pm EDT

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    @ Wilf --
    I love Penguins fans. In fact, I knocked down the notion that they only root for the name on the back of the sweater when it was brought up on the NHL Arena podcast on Sunday. Online, they're probably the most active and entertaining group.
    However, the team is radically different. It's stunning that there aren't more question marks from Pens fans than this blind devotion.
  12. mchpens
    12. Posted by mchpens Thu Sep 03, 2009 7:13 pm EDT

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    OK, Pens haters - The Pens will be solid this year. No they wont match last year but they will make the playoffs and when the playoffs start all bets are off. They have one of if not the strongest core players around. Yes Whitney missing a few months will hurt. Not cripple. Botom line, Caps will be tough, Ottawa will be Ottawa and the Pens will be right there. The Pens only week spot is there coach and if the Pens Struggle he will be gone!
  13. hooksorpik
    13. Posted by hooksorpik Thu Sep 03, 2009 7:09 pm EDT

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    I don't think it's too much of a homer move to peg the defending Eastern Conference champions (who have THE 2 top offensive centers in the game, return all their defensemen and starting goalie) as the team to beat in the East.
    The glasses are a little rose colored no doubt, and what fan DOESNT think/want their team to raise the Cup next spring....Especially a team that faired as well (and has the pieces in place) that Pittsburgh does.
  14. Wilf
    14. Posted by Wilf Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:46 pm EDT

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    Sure, Greg, there was roster turnover, and some of those departed made big contributions in the playoffs. There's a lot of that going around: the Flyers sent Umberger to the Columbus gulag and Jagr sent himself to the real gulag. Bottom line is that everybody in the league has roster churn. Some more than others, sure, but to compare a Penguins team that brought back Crosby, Malkin, Fleury, Staal, Orpik and Gonchar to an Oilers team that flew to the finals by the seat of its pants seems a little nutty.
  15. Stick Boy
    15. Posted by Stick Boy Thu Sep 03, 2009 9:43 pm EDT

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    @ hooksorpik
    1) The 2 top offensive centers don't equal a Cup, nor guarantee winning.
    2) If more attention was paid to some seriously great players, (Hossa et al) then maybe there'd be more players on the team.
    3) Role players are far more important than the top 2. They ALL have to mess.
    4) Ever hear of "team chemistry"?
    Crosby gets too much attention for: his own good, the team good, and that of the NHL. He's been labeled by Bettman as the Face of the NHL, and thats not fair. It really set him up for failure. Let him play, lets see what happens. As for the team being the team to beat in the East? Nope. Way too much confusion, change, and individualism.
  16. tmr
    16. Posted by tmr Thu Sep 03, 2009 3:04 pm EDT

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    The Penguins will have a good team this season - period. They will be exciting to watch and will do well against the East. IF they are FORTUNATE enough to repeat as Eastern Champs - and I know this hurts - they will be thumped by whoever wins the West. The exception to my scenario is a white-hot Pittsburgh goalie.
    People that say Pittsburgh will not make the playoffs underestimate their talent, drive, and energy.
    All this from a Wings fan...
  17. Leahy
    17. Posted by Leahy Thu Sep 03, 2009 9:27 pm EDT

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    "Detroit Red Wings didn't "have too many players considered ‘tough guys'" last season"
    One guy isn't many
  18. Wilf
    18. Posted by Wilf Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:46 pm EDT

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    Confusion? Individualism? WTF? I assure you there's plenty of collectivism in the Penguins' locker room. And I'm not sure what anybody's going to be confused about. Getting used to new wingers is something pros have to do.
  19. Wilf
    19. Posted by Wilf Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:46 pm EDT

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    Sean, don't forget Kronwall. He's tough as long as you let him leave his feet.
  20. olivematador
    20. Posted by olivematador Thu Sep 03, 2009 7:44 pm EDT

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    as a devout pens fan, i am still a realist. so, my stomach is in a tangle. i have no idea what to expect...i think that's why i like hockey so much. the orchestrated chaos and uncertainty keeps me coming back year after year after year...anything can happen in a sport with real athletes, structured economics, thinkers, and ice.
  21. Gregory T
    21. Posted by Gregory T Thu Sep 03, 2009 8:19 pm EDT

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    I live in the Detroit area and my wife is from Pittsburgh and have been a Red Wings fan my whole life. . I love the chances of the Penguins going all the way to the Stanley Cup again this year. Crosby, Malkin and Fluery will only get better this year. Their organization has done a great job of keeping their core players locked up for the long term. I dont think that it is impossible for the Penguins to be the next dynasty in hockey. The questions is will have learned enough from last years dissapointment? It's tough for a Wings fan to say this but the writing is on the wall. They have a legit chance of becoming great for a long time to come!
  22. chrisdsawyer
    22. Posted by chrisdsawyer Thu Sep 03, 2009 3:24 pm EDT

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    I simply cannot believe that people on this forum are actually opining that the Penguins will make the playoffs. Of course they are going to make the playoffs. More than half the teams make the playoffs and, this year, the team that has Crosby and Malkin will definitely be in the top half. No matter how you look at it, it is basically undisputed that Crosby and Malkin are two of the three best players in the world. And they are not even at they're prime yet. The salary cap will force adjustments year after year, but the Penguins simply will not be a "bottom-half" team for many years to come. Anything is possible in sports, but it would be a fool's bet to wager that the Penguins will be worse than half the teams in the league this year. The Penguins will not miss the playoffs for the next five years at least.
    Winning the Stanley Cup is another thing altogether. This year the Penguins have all the tools to get to the finals and win the Cup. But so do a number of other teams. Actually winning the Cup is about talent, discipline, stamina, and chemistry. The Penguins no doubt have the talent. But will the new team have the discipline, stamina, and chemistry? That will be Michel Terrien's burden and it looks as though he is on his game as much as any coach in the league. No one should underestimate Detroit, and lookout for some tough competition from the ambitious capitals the scrappy new Lightning.
  23. Stick Boy
    23. Posted by Stick Boy Thu Sep 03, 2009 9:43 pm EDT

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    @ Wilf
    Yes, individualism, and confusion. Crosby has been shoved down the throats of every hockey fan, and his own teammates. Its not a one, or 2 man show there. Its a team sport. 3 players alone aren't going to win. There needs to be an entire team, (that gets its due respect) around them. I have read many, many!!! Pens fans complain about Hossa leaving. I don't blame him. He was the best player in the Finals for the Pens, but did anyone do TV specials about him? Nope. The networks and the NHL were too busy talking to and about Crosby. I'd have left too, to play for anyone. Same goes for many others that left. Its pretty obvious.
    All that said, the Pens should still make the playoffs. Yep. They're a good team. But making the playoff's and winning the Cup is different. They walked thru the East last year but weren't even remotely prepared for the West and the Wings. (See games 1 &2)
    They're good. The "team to beat"? Nope.
  24. Koba
    24. Posted by Koba Thu Sep 03, 2009 7:24 pm EDT

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    Are Pens fans so blind? Did we not burn our Hossa jerseys, not simply in blind kneejerk "Et Tu Brute" disdain but in genuine fear of what we gave up to the Wings losing the Hoss? That God, BGL and Malone are painting Tampa Bay black and gold? That Conklin departed to our fresh new rival for a bag of peanuts and a promise of sipping from the Cup? Still, why not a case for a great season with a serious basis for optimism? I don't need to state the case for that any further than what's already been said. But seriously...
    ...when you prick us, do we not bleed?
  25. blueeyes_greeneyes
    25. Posted by blueeyes_greeneyes Thu Sep 03, 2009 3:09 pm EDT

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    Gregory T:
    I agree that the Penguins will be a strong team for years to come. I say that as a Wings fan, and no it's not painful to say. But again, I think the term "dynasty" should be withheld for now AT LEAST until a Cup has been won

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