Ball Don't Lie - NBA

Tue Jun 16, 2009 1:55 pm EDT

What's next for the Magic


Well, a good chunk of this post was significantly altered by a RealGM headline that told us that Hedo Turkoglu(notes) was "looking for $10m a year," which makes about zero sense, even considering an athlete's own distorted sense of self-worth.

Then I find out that the headline was written in response to a Chris Mannix column that tells us that Turkoglu "could be seeking" a contract that runs that high.

And while we can't base anything off of those quotes, this is what we're going to have to deal with this summer, especially with the Magic.

Beware an athlete's sense of self-worth.

And beware the media's sense of talent appraisals on players that are on TV an awful lot, particularly in spring and early summer.

Orlando's run to the NBA Finals, in a very large and real way, did absolutely nothing to change Orlando's obligations, wants, and needs in this offseason. Think about it.

Sure, the extra playoff games made it easier for Orlando to pay the luxury tax next season, but that was going to have to happen anyway. Even if the team let Marcin Gortat(notes) walk and signed Turkoglu for the league average, this team was likely going to stray into even the most optimistic estimates for the probable luxury tax line.

Beyond that, however, the team is right back where it was throughout the regular season. All year long we've been taking questions in our chats about Turkoglu's impending free agency (provided he opts out of the final year of his contract, worth $7.35 million, as reported and almost certainly a lock), and the answer remains the same.

He's a good player overall, but one who is just a step or two above average, a fact that is distorted by the way he has the ball in his hands all the time, and his prominent placement on a well-exposed team.

17 (on 41 percent shooting), five, and five is good, but to be expected for a man that plays 36 minutes a game and has the ball in his hands all the time. And, in the great scheme, above-average. Not an All-Star, a small shade below great, more or less "pretty good."

And "pretty good," in any climate, shouldn't be worth eight figures a year. Especially when the "pretty good" is going to turn 31 by the end of the first year of his new contract.

Really, the money he's opting out of? That's a pretty fair salary for Hedo. I'd call it slightly above fair, but I'm already assuming calls of "contrarian!" will be tossed my way after writing this, and I'm going to have to stop at some point. Just understand that he isn't "above average" for all basketball players, but when you list the NBA guys out 1-450, a person playing that many minutes and giving you 17-5-5 on 41 percent shooting is just an upshot or two from average.

Here's Orlando's problem. They can't trade for anyone. They can't sign anyone. The team doesn't have any trade bait, or bait that it would want to use.

Dwight Howard(notes) isn't going anywhere; and on the other end of the spectrum, nobody will even sniff Rashard Lewis(notes) and the three years and $58 million he has left on his contract before the final year (2012-13) goes unguaranteed. And as much as a good backup point guard with a passable contract in its final year sounds, why wouldn't the Magic just hang on to Rafer Alston(notes)?

And if they did want to trade Alston, nothing's doing until February, when the expiring salaries really start switching hands.

The team can't sign anyone, because they're capped out. And how. And Rashard.

As much as people are overshooting what Hedo "could" and should be looking for, the Magic can't afford to lose a significant rotation piece for nothing, because even if he bolts, the team would still be over the cap. Well over it, especially with Anthony Johnson(notes) picking up his player option.

So the Magic need Hedo. Both as a contributor, and as a person who can contribute to the team significantly without picking up stats as a result. They need him in a typical way, as a guy you can't lose for zero in return, but also as a player who has a unique skill set that wouldn't be replaceable even with trade options or salary cap flexibility.

That swings both ways, though.

Hedo needs the Magic. Not so much because he wouldn't get a chance to play point forward somewhere, mind you. He'd gladly take the cash and go become a typical small forward, in a second, and nobody should blame him.

But he needs them to toss more cash on top of the $7.35 million he'd be making this year had he not opted-out. And, I'm sorry, but he's not getting that anywhere. As ridiculous as GMs can get with players who are on TV a ton and were taken out of the offense down the stretch of the Finals by Trevor Ariza(notes), they still have to run things by their owners.

And as ridiculous and pie-eyed as some owners can get, I can't imagine any of them topping the pre-opt-out salary for a player that will turn 31 next March. And one that, while on national TV, looked absolutely gassed after two full days off between Finals games in Sunday's Game 5. And if some team comes along and wildly overpays the guy, then we can laugh and laugh and then get upset because that hypothetical team is now just as screwed as a Magic team without Hedo Turkoglu.

Expect Hedo back. They need each other. For a small raise, which wouldn't hurt much for 2009-10. Beyond that? The guy's going to be overpaid. You're going to be looking at well over $25 million a year of overpaid forwards in their 30s, Orlando. Get ready for it.

Which is why, as I wrote last summer, Orlando's time is now. Or, 11 and 12 months from now.

I seemed to be the only guy banging on about this team's potential to make the Finals, mainly because Lewis and Turkoglu were to be in their primes in 2008-09. Turns out I was wrong about the last part, because both players actually stepped back a bit last season. The decline has begun.

With two players near the top of that proverbial hill, 2009-10 has to be it for the team. And sadly, there is no provision plan for when Turkoglu and Lewis fade a bit, because Magic GM Otis Smith wildly overpaid so much for Lewis, and will likely (depending on the length, not the worth) do the same with Turkoglu.

Lewis' ridiculous deal made any attempts at rebuilding on the fly around Howard in a year and a half out of the question. And Lewis won't even be proper trade bait until 2012, as it is with Sasha Pavlovic(notes) right now, because the 2012-13 arm of his deal isn't guaranteed. Even then, it'll take almost $22 million worth of salaries just to make a deal. Not easy to do, at any point.

The Magic have to go now, while preparing for a Philadelphia 76ers-style (when Larry Brown and Billy King were handing out nutso contracts following the team's trip to the 2001 Finals) letdown. I'm not saying the team's on-court play will rival Philly's. No way. Not with that nucleus, not with Jameer Nelson(notes) improving and Dwight Howard already being way, way better at age 23 than Allen Iverson(notes) was in his prime.

The fallout, though, won't be great. Intractable deals.

Might as well get it in now, then. Sign Hedo, and unless Marcin Gortat signs a deal in the eight figures, you have to sign him as well. Starting quality centers, I don't care if you already have the best pivot in the NBA jumping center, are to be kept in the fold. You can always trade him a while down the line after you've matched any offer for him. So if any team signs him to MLE money (that is to say, the average deal), you match immediately for an already above-average center who is a few years away from his prime.

Beyond that, you're in a bit of trouble. You'd like to have another forward that can create his own shot, but you're paying Rashard Lewis to do it already, and he shows little inclination unless he's wide open. The wing pairing of Courtney Lee(notes) and Mickael Pietrus(notes) is just fine, especially at their price, and there's no reason to believe that Nelson (should he come to camp in shape, and we have no reason to think otherwise) can't continue his All-Star play.

Howard missed point blank shots in the Finals, consistently. He still needs work. He can also dominate offensively against the right matchup, and he dominates defensively against any team that isn't the Los Angeles Lakers. One of the best offensive teams I've ever seen, for what it's worth.

Alston? It's less of a deal than people, myself included, have made it out to be. You keep him, he'll be fine, he'll come off the bench. And if he does pipe up, then you trade the guy. There are dozens of players who make about the same amount of money as him (witness the recent Jason Kapono(notes)-for-Reggie Evans deal), everyone can always use a point guard, and he has an expiring deal. Win, and if he bitches, win.

Apologies for the dour and uncreative appraisal, but it's hard to be creative when you're left with a roster that doesn't leave much room for personnel upheaval. Unless some other team wants to make a very, very bad deal.

There are obvious things you'd like. A pure scorer at either wing position. The Magic need help scoring, you need Lewis out there for spacing, and you need someone who creates better shots that Lee and Pietrus do. You'd like a better backup point guard, because if the Finals are any indication, the Magic will fall off considerably with Alston on the court next year. Every team has needs. Only a few teams have a way of taking care of those needs. The Magic are not one of those teams.

But this is a Finals contender. It was entering last year, if everything went right, and everything went right. Yes, Kevin Garnett(notes) will be back and LeBron James(notes) (and, possibly, co.) will be better, but the Magic will still be great. Probably greater, with Nelson and Howard's advancements making up for Turkoglu and Lewis' slim declines.

The same set of urgency, however, has to come back. Whatever Stan Van Gundy traded for last October, he has to find a way to re-sign. These guys played harder and gave more consistent effort (despite the inconsistent play, at times) than any team in the NBA in 2008-09. If the Magic are to make it back, this effort has to return. All of it. One guy falls off? One guy gets fat and sassy? They're left behind.

Don't expect fireworks, Orlando, and don't expect to be put over the top with a new addition. Unless Smith really has some brass ones and signs-and-trades Turkoglu for something special.

Do expect, provided your favorite team brings the fire, to be just as good. Just as great.

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91 Comments

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  1. Coach Isiah Thompson
    1. Posted by Coach Isiah Thompson Tue Jun 16, 2009 2:09 pm EDT

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    Turkoglu passes to the man, Rodney shoots the 3 and "BOOM" goes the dynamite...free agency! And now you know the rest of the story.....good day! Discuss!
  2. Coach Toine
    2. Posted by Coach Toine Tue Jun 16, 2009 2:23 pm EDT

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    Turkoglu passes to the man, Rodney shoots the "3" and "BRICK", maybe he should move into his range since he shoots 29% from "3"........
  3. Tuck
    3. Posted by Tuck Tue Jun 16, 2009 2:23 pm EDT

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    wow, one of the best articles ive read on yahoo
  4. JP
    4. Posted by JP Tue Jun 16, 2009 2:33 pm EDT

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    "And "pretty good," in any climate, shouldn't be worth eight figures a year."
    -Maybe not, but that is how things are done in the NBA. Once a good player hits 30 or so they get that last lucrative deal, largely based on past performance and reputation. It's just the way it is. Compare Turk at $10/per to some other contracts in the NBA:
    2008 SF/PF Salaries:
    J O'Neal: $21.3 mil
    McGrady: $21.2 mil
    Marion: $17 mil
    Kirilenko: $15 mil
    Zach Randolph: 14.6 mil
    Ben Wallace: $14.5 mil
    Elton Brand: $13.7 mil
    Jason Richardson: $12.2 mil
    Vince Carter: $15.2 mil
    Richard Jefferson: $13.2 mil
    Troy Murphy: $10 mil
    Rasheed: $13.6 mil
    Wally Szcerbiak: $13 mil
    Josh Smith: $10 mil
    Turk is more important to his team than any of those guys were this past season. If I'm Otis Smith, I'd offer Turk 3 years at $10 per, team option in year 4 - take it or leave it.
  5. JP
    5. Posted by JP Tue Jun 16, 2009 2:34 pm EDT

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    Also, nice assessment KD.
  6. zesty_33_1970
    6. Posted by zesty_33_1970 Tue Jun 16, 2009 2:43 pm EDT

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    Anyone outside of Orlando knows this team had enough to win the title, like the Heat did when the brought Riley back to the bench, the Magic need a coach who knows how to win it all and not just get them there.
    But anyway, when KG returns next season, the Celts will probably end Laker dynasty talk and have the Magic searching for answers and leave LeBron looking to get out.!!!
  7. KD
    7. Posted by KD Tue Jun 16, 2009 2:47 pm EDT

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    That's now it has to be done when you have leverage on your side.
    Smith and Brand signed those deals last year, and they had leverage. All the other players signed in, essentially, a different era.
    He can offer him the same 'take it or leave it deal' at 8 per, and where is Turk going to go to top that mark?
  8. El Robotos De Hasselhoff
    8. Posted by El Robotos De Hasselhoff Tue Jun 16, 2009 2:47 pm EDT

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    Hedo's more important to the Magic than Rashard Lewis and how much money does that guy make??
  9. Simmsinns
    9. Posted by Simmsinns Tue Jun 16, 2009 2:50 pm EDT

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    What's next for the Magic: not much
  10. Rise With Us
    10. Posted by Rise With Us Tue Jun 16, 2009 2:53 pm EDT

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    Rashard will start dating Rihanna and Chris Brown will get pist. She'll become a regular at Magic home games just like Eva at Spurs games. Brown wont be allowed in the arena. LOL
    Magic probably wont change all that much. It will be tougher though cause KG will be back in Boston and the Cavs will make a trade to get better. Cant wait for next year!!
  11. DJ D.
    11. Posted by DJ D. Tue Jun 16, 2009 3:06 pm EDT

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    Good post Zesty! If KG isn't hurt, they beat the Magic, the Cavs, and maybe even the Lakers.
    I know that since this is the finals, every player is under the microscope. I think it's safe to say that Hedo is one the worst defenders in the NBA, D-league, and overseas as well.
    No way in the world is that guy worth 10 million and the Magic wasted a ton of loot and Lewis as well seeing that he isn't far from Hedo in the "terrible defender" category.
    Should Boston stay healthy and get a decent backup PG, they'll cruise to the finals.
    As for the Lakers, I wouldn't be surprised if Denver makes a trip to the finals next year.
  12. Benjamin R
    12. Posted by Benjamin R Tue Jun 16, 2009 3:14 pm EDT

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    Really?
    Really?
    You just lost a WHOLE lot of credibility to me as a basketball fan!
    Dwight Howard......better than Iverson in his prime?!?! You do realize that "in his prime" Iverson was the greatest scorer in the league right?
    So, your argument is that a player, who just MIGHT end up being the greatest F/C to play the game (if he doesn't go the way of Amare) who currrently averages 20 ppg (3 points more than the guy you're advocating does not deserve a raise) is better than a 9-time All-Star and former MVP who was picking up scoring titles like they were trading cards in his prime?????
    So I guess you thought Tim Duncan was better that Ivey in his prime as well? Never heard anyone make THAT case! And guess what? Dwight is in his prime, yet stat-wise is virtually IDENTICAL to Tim Duncan who in his 11th season is WAAAY past his prime! Sorry, but Dwight is a media darling who is nowhere NEAR as good as people think he is yet. Dude has a lot of upside but he is inconsistent and one dimensional.
    Are you legitimately RETARDED or just acting out? That is the single most outrageously inane comment I've heard from a commentator since - well that IS THE most outrageous comparison I've ever heard!
    Just so you know I stopped reading your article after that line.
  13. sam spade
    13. Posted by sam spade Tue Jun 16, 2009 3:31 pm EDT

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    Anthony Johnson, DNPCD. I think SVG has repeated his mistakes when with the Heat. Do you really think anyone wants to play for him anymore? I don't. Rafer has no real relationship with SVG. I believe he'd like out. Turkoglu could be like Morning and Shaq. Pat Riley has no chance of coming through the door at mid-season. I believe that SVG's actions will cause this team to splinter beyond recognition. I wouldn't want to play for him anymore after Anthony Johnson, DNPCD. It meant that the team that won the ECF, DNPCD. I'd be willing to bet there are hard feelings against SVG, that time won't heal.
  14. sam spade
    14. Posted by sam spade Tue Jun 16, 2009 3:41 pm EDT

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    If you watched during the timeouts of the last game, i believe that SVG lost the team. I believe that just like the Heat; he'll be fired by mid season because the players just like Shaq and Morning will want him gone. They won't be back. SVG had a running battle of words with Superman. I believe everyone's tired of SVG. The team that won the ECF championship is no more and never will return.
  15. Dr-B
    15. Posted by Dr-B Tue Jun 16, 2009 3:43 pm EDT

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    Current design of the Orlando Team made them the finalist of 2008-9. But it is also obvious that they need to improve on top of the current design, if they want to be a champion. Lee and Pietrus are good players, but they couldn't slow down Kobe. They should get a very good sixth man, who will easily replace one of the starter forwards (I have crazy ideas such as Artest ;). Signing Hedo is a must, if they want to keep the current team design. He made so many critical last minute shots both during the season and the finals. In many games, he defended best player of the opposing team and organized the game in the offense. Finding the right replacement for Hedo is almost impossible in terms of style.
  16. swingers
    16. Posted by swingers Tue Jun 16, 2009 3:52 pm EDT

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    Quit crying Kelly. As a Houston Rockets fan, it is annoying to hear Orlando fans cry about Rashard's monster contract. Just look at Tracy's contract. Yeah. At least Rashard makes it past the first round and hits shots that count, not to mention he plays in most games.
  17. Erock
    17. Posted by Erock Tue Jun 16, 2009 3:57 pm EDT

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    Guys, don't be ridiculous. We are talking about Otis Smith here, before any teams make offers we will sign Hedo to a 12mil/yr for 5 year deal. Marcin will walk because he wants to start, and he should. Orlando is screwed, Rashard is our big money MJ man at 19 mil a year and while he showed flashes with big time shots that got us to the finals, he also showed us flashes of why he isn't a 19 mil player, taking games off in must win games because if his shot is off from the outside he has no other real way to contribute and it shows in his play. Hedo deserves an extension, not a raise. He is great in the Magic system, but anywhere else he is average at best. We as Magic fans have to hope that Rashard practices his post moves, Jameer gets better than pre-injury form last year, and most importantly, Lee gets 100x better than his finals showing (offensively). Hedo can stay put skill wise, and hopefully Pietrus gets into form and stays away from injury. But for trade pieces, don't we have Battie, Alston and AJ as expiring?
  18. Yucaipa L A K E R S fan
    18. Posted by Yucaipa L A K E R S fan Tue Jun 16, 2009 4:05 pm EDT

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    No way the could celtics beat the LAKERS with KG...couldn't do it in the regular season and Kobe would not let that happen in the finals....sorry but true.
  19. Rise With Us
    19. Posted by Rise With Us Tue Jun 16, 2009 4:29 pm EDT

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    #19
    Explain last year then.
  20. jaba t
    20. Posted by jaba t Tue Jun 16, 2009 4:44 pm EDT

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    "...Dwight Howard already being way, way better at age 23 than Allen Iverson(notes) was in his prime."
    You mean the same Dwight Howard who was rendered completely useless by Pau GaSoft? And the same Allen Iverson who led the Sixers to the Finals in '01 when their second leading scorer was Theo Ratliff at a whopping 12.4ppg?
  21. DICK SMOTHERS
    21. Posted by DICK SMOTHERS Tue Jun 16, 2009 5:01 pm EDT

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    "WAAAAAHHHHH!!!"
  22. Evan
    22. Posted by Evan Tue Jun 16, 2009 5:27 pm EDT

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    The 76ers almost upset the Magic in the first round. I think a lot of their success can be attributed to Turkoglu. Granted, he wouldn't be the player he is if he didn't have Lewis holding it down behind the arc, threatening defenses. But Hedo throws some awesome oops though, and hits clutch shots, fadeaways, jumpers, reverse layups. Don't blame Hedo for demanding a fair contract, he's a baller.
  23. Steven
    23. Posted by Steven Tue Jun 16, 2009 5:30 pm EDT

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    Now Boston Celtics understands what it means not to have an important starter playing. That's why Lakers lost last year!
  24. Smokin Joe Fraze
    24. Posted by Smokin Joe Fraze Tue Jun 16, 2009 5:32 pm EDT

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    KD Actually Hedo was an All-Star the season before last so you're wrong.
    The Magic have options don't kid yourself. First of all Artest is a free agent and plays SF too. If they replace Hedo with Artest the rest of the NBA chits their pants. Maybe they lose Hedo this off season and save for 2010 with LeBron & Wade? Tony Battie's 5.8 million will be free'd up as he will be let go and they can resign Gortat (They have to resign Gortat because defensively, when Howard is on the bench they don't lose too much but without Gortat it will get ugly).
    As far as Rashard being overpaid... He hit 2 game winners in the Eastern Conference Finals. Without those the Magic don't make the Finals. He also single-handedly carried them in Game 2 with 34 points, 11 boards, 3-6 from 3-point and 7 Assists on only 2 TO's. MOST people would call that money well spent.
    No Hedo in 2009 would only equal more Howard, Rashard and Jameer and they ALL shoot a higher percentage than Hedo so again how exactly is that a bad thing? If Hedo opts out and the Magic don't get a replacement from another team they will simply move Pietrus to SF which on the defensive end he's already used to guarding the leagues top SF's. Offensively he will have to learn to look to get his teammates shots before his own and that would be a signifficant drop from Hedo. Starting 5 would be Howard, Rashard, Pietrus, Lee and Nelson. Small lineup yes but still a 48+ win team no question. Then they can go after Wade or LeBron in 2010 and if they land one of them you already know the rest... Magic = Champions
  25. DeDe Co.
    25. Posted by DeDe Co. Tue Jun 16, 2009 5:37 pm EDT

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    The Magic will be fine next season. They'll still be top 3 in there conference and be a finals contender. Look we wouldnt even be having this discussion had the finals gone 7 games which i expected it would and should have. If Courtney Lee makes that last second inbound lob-pass at the end of regulation in game 2 and Howard makes just one of those 2 free throws at the end of game 4(and even with the misses, Jameer Nelson realizes that being up by 3 with seconds remaining, he might wanna play up on Fisher to, at the very least, force a bad shot) they're up 3-1 headed into game 5. But should've, could've ,would've. Congrats to the Lake-show. Magic, you had a great season and made a great run at the title. Build upon that. and for you laker fans...if KG is healthy, the Celtics repeat...bottom line.

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