Big League Stew - MLB

When appropriate, Big League Stew reviews a key decision during the playoffs to see if the right one was made.

The Turning Point: Dodgers manager Joe Torre stuck with rookie left-hander Clayton Kershaw(notes) for six batters after Carlos Ruiz(notes) put the Phillies ahead with a three-run homer in the fifth inning. The sixth man, Ryan Howard(notes), hit a two-run double to make it 5-1 Phillies before Torre changed pitchers. Kershaw, at 21 the youngest starting pitcher in league championship series history, allowed five runs, four hits and five walks — along with a record three wild pitches in the fifth alone. Philadelphia beat the Dodgers 8-6 to take Game 1 of the NLCS.

The Question: Did Torre err by not acting sooner on Kershaw, perhaps after he walked pitcher Cole Hamels(notes)? Like Grady Little sticking with Pedro Martinez(notes) during Game 7 of the 2003 ALCS, might the decision to stick with with Kershaw hang around Torre's neck?

Let the kid pitch: Kershaw is the Dodgers' best pitcher; that's why Torre went with him in the series opener. The Phillies are vulnerable to lefties and with left- or- switch-hitting Jimmy Rollins(notes), Shane Victorino(notes), Chase Utley(notes) and Howard coming up in the fifth, you might as well use the live lefty arm already on the mound. Besides, Kershaw got two outs before facing Howard, who had a weak split against lefties (.207 batting, .653 OPS) this season.

Go to the bullpen: Kershaw tossed four scoreless innings to start, but he didn't get through them clean. And the fifth was shaping up into a disaster from the beginning. The biggest clue Kershaw was off was a walk to Pedro Feliz(notes) just before Ruiz went deep. Feliz almost never walks.

Hindsight is 20/20: How was Torre to know that the Phillies would keep scoring later in the game against his vaunted bullpen, notably lefty George Sherrill(notes)? The Dodgers also managed 14 base hits, which should be enough to score plenty of runs and erase the damage for which Kershaw was responsible.

Their say:

• "I mean, I had guys warming up. Certainly unexpected. I had a choice; after the three-run homer, he walked the pitcher, he gets a ground out and a strike out, then we have two left-handers coming up, and I have to make a decision whether I want Scott Elbert(notes) to pitch to them or Clayton Kershaw. You know, to me, he's a starting pitcher in Game 1, so I felt that that's what I wanted to do." — Joe Torre

• "That's too early for [Hong-Chih Kuo(notes)], yeah. I mean, I've got a quality left-hander on the mound. Things didn't work out. We gave away too much as far as the number of walks we issued. But I mean, this young man, I trust him a great deal, and it just didn't work out tonight." — Torre

• " ... It looked like he reined it in a little bit when he got Rollins and he struck out Victorino. But those next two guys [Utley and Howard] are pretty tough." — Torre

• "The first four innings I felt great, and then I couldn't make adjustments fast enough. In the playoffs, you're not going to have a lot of leverage. If you don't make your pitches, before long you're out of there." — Clayton Kershaw

Stew Verdict: When it came to pulling his starter, Torre treated Game 1 of the NLCS like it was a middle-of-June affair against the Padres. Torre is the guy with six pennants and four World Series titles, not some rookie manager in over his head. He believed too much in Kershaw, who was dominant in the division-clincher against the Rockies. Kershaw might be the Second Coming of Sandy Koufax before it's all over, but even Koufax wasn't great until he turned 25.

Torre's lack of urgency might not have cost the Dodgers anything — how many of us can tell Scott Elbert from Roger Ebert? — but pulling Kershaw was the prudent thing to do after walks to Felix and Hamels. Many believe that Little (whom Torre coincidentally succeeded in L.A.) cost the Red Sox the World Series by not pulling Pedro back in '03. Torre, compared to Grady? Say it ain't so, Joe!

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21 Comments

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  1. f
    1. Posted by f Fri Oct 16, 2009 6:30 am EDT

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    go boston
  2. born in norcal
    2. Posted by born in norcal Fri Oct 16, 2009 7:07 am EDT

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    And by the end of the game,Man-Hole SCUMirez' HR didn't amount to SQUAT!
  3. kingpaddy
    3. Posted by kingpaddy Fri Oct 16, 2009 7:11 am EDT

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    Kershaw can pitch for me any game. 171 innings pitched , hits 119. Hits and innings pitched are almost always close to being equal. 171/119 Crazy good. Hit him while you can.
  4. kingpaddy
    4. Posted by kingpaddy Fri Oct 16, 2009 7:14 am EDT

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    It amounted to a Home run? What? Was a UFO supposed to show up or something.
    I guess Barry's were worthless too.
  5. l34w29
    5. Posted by l34w29 Fri Oct 16, 2009 7:35 am EDT

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    Even George W Bush is a genius when he's able to apply hindsight to a subjective evaluation. Kershaw has been very, very good this season. Torre's decision to pitch him 1st in the series was sound. Leaving him in after 2 walks in the 5th was a decision based more on trying to save a relief pitcher which, under the circumstances, was the correct decision. Torre cannot foresee the future. If he could he would be the freakin' emperor of the world. Big League Stew is way, way out of line trying to create a controversy where none exists.
  6. l34w29
    6. Posted by l34w29 Fri Oct 16, 2009 7:35 am EDT

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    Even George W Bush is a genius when he's able to apply hindsight to a subjective evaluation. Kershaw has been very, very good this season. Torre's decision to pitch him 1st in the series was sound. Leaving him in after 2 walks in the 5th was a decision based more on trying to save a relief pitcher which, under the circumstances, was the correct decision. Torre cannot foresee the future. If he could he would be the freakin' emperor of the world. Big League Stew is way, way out of line trying to create a controversy where none exists.
  7. yclipper05
    7. Posted by yclipper05 Fri Oct 16, 2009 7:56 am EDT

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    Did anyone ask the follow-up question of why was it too early for Kuo?
  8. RaymondGuy
    8. Posted by RaymondGuy Fri Oct 16, 2009 8:05 am EDT

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    Second guess Joe? How dare you! Joe is 100% Hall of Fame. Well 100% asterisk * HoF*
    When judging a manager one must take into account that Joe's 15 straight playoff games had 15 straight years of drug enhanced players. How did Joe miss that? Was he completely blind to this cheating even after being around players all his life? Could it be that Joe couldn't give a flying bunt and is a cheater himself?
    * Get all the Asterisk players and managers out of MLB *
    Start by getting Bud Selig out of MLB
  9. Jo Bangles
    9. Posted by Jo Bangles Fri Oct 16, 2009 8:13 am EDT

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    The fact is that the Dodgers played like crap. They hit, but not enough to cancel out the poor pitching, and not enough with men on period. The Phillies didn't exactly play like world champs either. If neither team shows up over the next few games, the AL will make short work of the NL in the World Series.
    Yclipper is asking a good question. Why not bring Kuo in at that point? And why have Elbert on the roster at all if Torre feels he's untested and is hesitant to go to him with the game on the line? That's the type of situation where you'd like to be able to go to a veteran like Weaver. Look at the Phillies - they went to Chan Ho and he got them out of a jam. Big mistake leaving the post-season to rookies.
  10. * * * * * * * *
    10. Posted by * * * * * * * * Fri Oct 16, 2009 8:27 am EDT

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    here are some stats for paddyandmike69 (cause he likes stats now)
    7 walks, three wild pitches & two home runs .................................
    **** take the pain suckers ****
  11. Chris
    11. Posted by Chris Fri Oct 16, 2009 8:28 am EDT

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    Last nights game is the exact reason why dodger fans should shut the hell up and stop talking crap because you have not earned it. We smoked you guys last year easily and last night we took down your best pitcher plus the guy in your pen sherrill that you have been bragging about for weeks. Sherrill this sherrill that the guy is good but the phils are bettter. Also what's up with all the empty seats in the stadium last night. You could see rows of seats empty right behind the batters box. The dodgers faithful still is unchanged from last year when they come on here and talk crap all the time even when they lose but they won't go to a home game.
    BTW Hamels has been off and on this year and he just out pitched your best pitcher so your team is in more trouble than you think it is. You really don't think wolf or padilla is better than lee do you.
    All this ranting is me just wondering why you guys don't brag about your team after they win a series against us you brag before you win anything and you see in the post above me dodger fans are looking for excuses on why you lost. It's really simple until you knock off the defending champs we are the better team.
  12. boasocal
    12. Posted by boasocal Fri Oct 16, 2009 8:38 am EDT

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    Yes Torre erred, no doubt about it. A kid with an 8-8 record is their BEST PITCHER, therein lies their problem. Their rotation and lineup are inferior to the Phils. You can argue against that all night long. The Phils are now 5 of 6 against this team over the last two postseasons. Keep focusing on the Phils bullpen, while their lineup crushes you.....it's very funny. Torre like LaRussa is massively overrated. Give him a $300 payroll and he's crackerjack....sort of like that guy Jackson with the Lakers......very overrated.
  13. theprez98
    13. Posted by theprez98 Fri Oct 16, 2009 8:51 am EDT

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    I'm glad Joe Torre gets 5 minute "timeouts" to allow his pitcher to put on his spikes. Seriously, that's ridiculous. And seriously, Joe Torre made a timeout "T" as if baseball actually had timeouts. Horrible umping in game one.
  14. uhh, clem
    14. Posted by uhh, clem Fri Oct 16, 2009 10:28 am EDT

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    Torre blew that one. No way you can leave Kershaw in to face Howard. He was long gone at that point. Of course that ends in a two run double ... and - Yes, Honeycut did go to the mound that inning.
    The bigger picture though? No way you can go into this post season and think you will tame both the Cards and that Phillies line up with the starters the Dodgers have. Unfortunately, this was decided at the trade deadline. This was not a surprise. At some point you need an ace. Kershaw isn't quite it.
    they'll just have to wait until next year now.
  15. John
    15. Posted by John Fri Oct 16, 2009 10:35 am EDT

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    Back to the headline, this was not at all like Grady Little's blunder. Pedro was well known to only have about 7 innings and 100 pitches in him before he would croak, it happened frequently throughout the season. Pedro himself was shaking hands like he was finished at the end of the 7th. Grady had two pitchers lined up who were lights-out unhittable for the 8th and 9th. If they had struggled, it would have been a surprise, but he still would have had more than enough amo behind them. Grady Little gave away the pennant (and easily world series since the only team the Marlins could beat was the yankees) by trying to rub the yankees nose in defeat with their most hated pitcher, Pedro. It's too bad Pedro just didn't say no to going back out, but that's not his style, nor that of any competitor. Torre's move only looks bad in retrospect, it could easily have gone either way, but Grady's move was clearly folly from the start.
  16. Speed Racer
    16. Posted by Speed Racer Fri Oct 16, 2009 10:46 am EDT

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    The bottom line is that the team that plays their best is going to win. Chis, you are ranting and raving a lot for a team that gave up 6 run and 14 hit (compared to 8 hits for the Phils). The Dodgers lost because they made more mistakes (five of the Phillie runs were guys who walked). None of the Phillie pitchers looked that sharp for Phillie fans to be so confident (other than Chan Ho Park). Hats off to the Phillies for capitallizing on their opportunities but the Dodgers didn't have the best record in the NL or go 4-3 against the Phillies in the regular season because of poor starting pitching.
    BTW I don't think Joe Torre showed up to that game!?
  17. craigerl19
    17. Posted by craigerl19 Fri Oct 16, 2009 11:04 am EDT

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    Hey f... F Boston... They're at home watching on TV... Get over it. The Phillies are the new dynasty. Also, Tom Brady is a b***h... (Just a meaningless comment to respond to your meaningless comment).
    Honestly, Ryan Howard is smoking hot right now. I think he does the same on whatever pitcher Torre brings into the game. Ibanez hits the homer regardless of what Torre does with Kershaw. You know what? It's over, the Phils won, Pedro's on the mound in a new game today and every Phillies fan should be excited for that kind of postseason veteran to be on the mound. LET'S GO PHILS!
  18. Brian P
    18. Posted by Brian P Fri Oct 16, 2009 1:08 pm EDT

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    I agree completely with post 15. Pedro was gassed in that game, and everybody knew it. That's the reason Grady's error was so legendary. Kershaw shouldn't have that problem this early in the game. I think a lot of the time a pitcher with his stuff can get out of a jam like that.
  19. V
    19. Posted by V Fri Oct 16, 2009 1:11 pm EDT

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    why is pete rose banned from the hall and steroid users are still allowed to play the game, manny is a fraud he roided all the way up to this year, and he had to b/c he was on a steroid that you use to get yourself off hard steroid use. you can't cold turkey with hard steroid use he will be in bad shape in the next few years like mcguire. unless he uses a lite steroid.
  20. bill t
    20. Posted by bill t Fri Oct 16, 2009 1:52 pm EDT

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    Joe played way more games at third base than he caught. Del Crandall was the catcher for the braves in the day. This guy don't know squat.
  21. GOLDEN BOY
    21. Posted by GOLDEN BOY Thu Oct 22, 2009 12:14 pm EDT

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    Hope you blow suks fans enjoy our american league pennent corination tonight. two weeks from now you'll watch the return of the yankees back to our rightful place one top of major league baseball. all things with the world are almost back in order. boston you had your fun now its time for the king to reign again........

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