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Could Chase Utley(notes) be voted the World Series MVP even if the Phillies check out in six or seven?

That's the question being asked today by The Sporting News' Dan Levy, a noted Phillies fan and a Philadelphia-area based friend of The Stew. 

(Translation: Don't get all over my case, because it was a Fightins' fan who first brought it up.) 

At any rate, I love this type of argument, particularly for the lazy workout day before what should be a great Game 6 on Wednesday. Losing MVPs are the farthest thing from a frequent occurrence in the playoffs, but they haven't been completely absent either. There's been one losing Super Bowl MVP (the Cowboys' Chuck Howley in Super Bowl V), one losing NBA Finals MVP (the Lakers' Jerry West in 1969) and five losing Conn Smythe winners in the NHL (which is based on the entire Stanley Cup run, not just the finals).

There's also been only one losing World Series MVP in Yankees second baseman Bobby Richardson, who had 12 RBIs against Pittsburgh in the 1960 World Series and presented a case that apparently couldn't be swayed by his Pirates counterpart hitting one of the most famous home runs in the history of baseball.  

So could Utley join Richardson as guys who left with a nice parting gift?

As much as I'd like to be non-conformist and say yes, I think I have to say probably not. 

If you were to take a vote right now — ie: without a World Series winner having been decided —  there's probably no question that Utley would get the award. His two multi-homer games have keyed both of Philadelphia's wins and he's hit five overall homers to join Reggie Jackson as the most homeriffic Fall Classicker. He's hitting .333 overall and produced enough power to pull the weight of the guy striking out behind him

But MVP cases have also been mounted on the other side of the field by Alex Rodriguez(notes), Mariano Rivera(notes) and Johnny Damon(notes), while Derek Jeter(notes) is just waiting for one signature moment to build a case. It's hard to imagine that one of them (or another late-charging Yankee) won't figure even more prominently into a World Series clinching win.

Throw in the fact that the media will be eager to give either A-Rod or Rivera a lifetime achievement award and it's hard to see Utley stealing the MVP — no matter how good his numbers are.

But Utley, of course, is just a way of Trojan horsing our way into the debate on whether a player from a losing team can ever win World Series MVP. The Phillies could win the next two games while A-Rod hits a grand slam in both of them and this argument would be completely reversed. 

My take: While a player can win a regular season MVP without a plethora of team achievements, I tend to think that the World Series MVP should be reserved as an honor for the winning team, much like the extra playoff kitty they get to divide up into shares.

If the award was defined by the entire postseason run — in which case it'd be going to A-Rod — that might be another story. But in a six- or seven-game series, the spoils should mostly go to the victor with an exception only being made in the rarest of cases.

What do you think? Should a World Series MVP ever come from the losing squad?

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  1. Arik K
    1. Posted by Arik K Tue Nov 03, 2009 6:18 pm EST

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    I don't see why not, it happens with the Conn Smythe in hockey. Granted, that's for the whole playoffs, but the point is the same. Just because a whole team isn't as competitive as one player doesn't mean that one player should be punished.
  2. theprez98
    2. Posted by theprez98 Tue Nov 03, 2009 6:21 pm EST

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    "Chase Utley, YOU ARE THE MAN!"
    --Harry Kalas
  3. camdencrazies
    3. Posted by camdencrazies Tue Nov 03, 2009 6:23 pm EST

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    Thus far, Utley has a Win Probability Added of .302 for the series, while Cliff Lee is at .604. A-Rod is at .345. If the Phillies win the series then Utley will probably win the MVP. Otherwise there will likely be at least one guy from the Yankees who's actually deserving himself.
    Nice that Chase is getting some much deserved attention though.
  4. Jaybatt79
    4. Posted by Jaybatt79 Tue Nov 03, 2009 6:24 pm EST

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    It's really an interestiung argument. There's no question, the Yankees have outplayed the Phillies to this point and have several players who have performed well. At the same time, there hasn't been one guy who's stood out. It's really been a team effort. With no Utley in the conversation, I would be hard pressed to pick one Yankee who deserves the award over the rest of the team. Meanwhile Utley is almost single-handedly taken this series back to New York so it's really interesting. That being said, I would probably pick Rivera at this point. 3 saves and 5 scoreless innings when the rest of the bullpen has been horrible.
  5. Luis J
    5. Posted by Luis J Tue Nov 03, 2009 6:29 pm EST

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    If Utley hits another homer to set the record for a World Series you have to give him the MVP!
  6. ally
    6. Posted by ally Tue Nov 03, 2009 7:40 pm EST

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    I agree with Luis J. Another home run for Chase and he should definitely get MVP, even if the Phillies lose!
  7. beerlover
    7. Posted by beerlover Tue Nov 03, 2009 7:59 pm EST

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    The only thing is that Utley isn't single-handedly keeping the Phils in. It's him AND Cliff. I mean, yes, unless something drastic changes in the next game or two, Utley has been the most valuable player, followed closely by Cliff, and nobody on the Yankees. Maybe Rivera. If you take out Utley, maybe the Phils are still in this. If you take out Cliff Lee, they aren't. Period. If the series goes 7 and Cliff wins 3, you have to give it to him, again unless Utley has more and more homers.
    And this Jeter nonsense is ridiculous. If he hits at least one grand slam and has defensive (like, game-saving) play in each of the next two games, you can consider him. He won't, though, so you can.t I can't even watch a Bowling Green - Buffalo football game on a Tuesday without hearing Jeter (disclaimer: actually Geter, a BGSU player).
  8. Jo Bangles
    8. Posted by Jo Bangles Tue Nov 03, 2009 8:56 pm EST

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    Giving the MVP to a player from the losing team is ridiculous. If the Phillies come back to win, then yes, he's MVP. If not, then you give the award to the most valuable Yankee.
  9. Shaun T
    9. Posted by Shaun T Tue Nov 03, 2009 9:03 pm EST

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    Yankees win it's Mo
    Phillies win it's Utley
  10. Shaun T
    10. Posted by Shaun T Tue Nov 03, 2009 9:03 pm EST

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    Yankees win it's Mo
    Phillies win it's Utley
  11. Shaun T
    11. Posted by Shaun T Tue Nov 03, 2009 9:03 pm EST

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    Yankees win it's Mo
    Phillies win it's Utley
  12. DJ.TONEY2MUCH
    12. Posted by DJ.TONEY2MUCH Tue Nov 03, 2009 9:15 pm EST

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    I dont care about who gets the mvp...i want the yankees to win their 27th world series...uttly could have it and all the left over beer from the stadium....f$#@k mvp...rings will do :0)
  13. xbsquaredx
    13. Posted by xbsquaredx Tue Nov 03, 2009 9:15 pm EST

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    Most valuable player should go to, and this may be tough to get, THE MOST VALUABLE PLAYER. Should it matter if his team wins or loses? Nope. It should be, and again this is realllllllly hard to comprehend, the player who provided the most value to their team. I'm not making an argument about Utley here, I'm just saying---the award is pretty clearly named. Imagine someone broke the homerun, RBI and stolen bases records in a world series while their team got swept---would we have this argument? No, we wouldn't, we'd give the guy his MVP trophy. Thus, the whole "should be reserved for the winning team" argument is moot as we can all imagine a situation in which the MVP would go to a player on the losing team. If you disagree with me on that point, you can argue about whether or not it should be solely for the winning team, but I think it is pretty ridiculous to suggest that it should ALWAYS go to the winning team. I'm not arguing that Utley deserves it, I'm just saying the arguments that it has to go to the winning team are not based on a terrible about of reasoned out thought.
  14. JerBear50
    14. Posted by JerBear50 Tue Nov 03, 2009 10:33 pm EST

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    I hope he doesn't, just because I don't want to hear Yankee fan whine, b*tch, and moan for the next year. Their usual obnoxious b.s. is bad enough.
  15. sam spade
    15. Posted by sam spade Tue Nov 03, 2009 11:14 pm EST

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    why not? He's already been the most exciting player in this series. We will remember his HR's forever. He has etched his place in WS history forever. Why isn't he the odds on favorite now? regardless of who you're for chase Utley has been magnificent.
  16. JP
    16. Posted by JP Tue Nov 03, 2009 11:22 pm EST

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    I agree with DJ........I'm all about #27........nothing else matters!!!
  17. Brian P
    17. Posted by Brian P Tue Nov 03, 2009 11:34 pm EST

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    I would only vote for a member of the losing team if there wasn't a single outstanding player on the winning side, and if the guy from the losing team was playing out of his head for the entire Series. Utley has been bananas, but there are deserving Yankees so I wouldn't vote for him for this award.
  18. Nwaf A
    18. Posted by Nwaf A Tue Nov 03, 2009 11:47 pm EST

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    no question yes.
  19. rluter85
    19. Posted by rluter85 Wed Nov 04, 2009 12:06 am EST

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    I really wanna know why isnt anybody acknowledging what jeter has been doing this whole postseason im a big yankees fan and everyone saying a-rod but lets look at the stats jeter is doing better. a-rod just get a good hit at the end of the game while jeter been busting his butt the whole game i believe jeter deserves the mvp award
  20. DannyR
    20. Posted by DannyR Wed Nov 04, 2009 12:08 am EST

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    Most Valuable Player should go to the individual who demonstrated the most value to either of the two teams, regardless of who wins. MVP should not be confused, and automatically meshed into, the award for Most Valuable Team, which is already bestowed via the title "World Champions." Sorta like, Best Picture doesn't automatically bestow Best Actor/Actress... and shouldn't.
  21. philsphanwest
    21. Posted by philsphanwest Wed Nov 04, 2009 12:10 am EST

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    Not one mention of Johnny Damon. Wow. Damon has been huge for the Yankees. His plays at the end of Game 4 probably will turn out to be the difference in this series. Damon makes the 3rd out in the top of the 9th in that game, and the Phillies look really good to win. The Yankees have to decide whether to blow Rivera in the bottom half tied, or throw one of the other relievers back out there against the top of the Phillies lineup. A-Rod may have driven him in, but Damon's 9 pitch at-bat to get on was way more clutch. A-Rod was facing a Lidge who was limited to throwing fastball only, thanks to Damon's base-running. Really not that tough. A-Rod's HR against Hamels in Game 3 got the Yankees on the board, but again, it was Damon's double that really blew the game open.
    I know Rivera is a popular guy, but he's saved leads of 2 runs once, and 3 runs twice. Not the same as having saved three 1-run nail biters.
  22. ICEMAN
    22. Posted by ICEMAN Wed Nov 04, 2009 12:40 am EST

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    No he just steal signs that's the reason he hits homers! LOL
  23. Richard
    23. Posted by Richard Wed Nov 04, 2009 12:44 am EST

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    in cleveland we have had loosing seasons the last 10 to 12 years but we had 2 cy young winners although the year c.c won his we were as they say 1out away. what i don't like is the fact that who ever started this abought the phillies loosing is a losser them selves. the phillies are the raining champs it will take those damn yankees 2 games to knock them off. i would like to see it go all 7 games with the 2 stating pitchers going against each other and with all do respect to c.c. a phillies win and 2 mvp winners in chase utley and cliff lee. then 2 former cleveland indians tying for the cy young awards. know that would be a classic finish for us losser cleveland fans. we have indered enough when it comes to are sports teams. hopefully we will have a champ at the end of this basketball season.
  24. Mike L
    24. Posted by Mike L Wed Nov 04, 2009 1:08 am EST

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    MVP means you've done something to help your team WIN. It doesn't matter if they lose in 4 or they lose in 7, losing is losing. Most Valuable Loser should be the name of the award in the playoffs.
    If the Yankees win in 6 and A Rod has another good game, it's all his. If it goes to game 7 and CC is dominant, it goes to him.
    If the Phils win, it's all Utley because you know Howard hasn't done anything to help.
  25. Mike L
    25. Posted by Mike L Wed Nov 04, 2009 1:09 am EST

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    MVP means youve done something to help your team WIN. It doesnt matter if they lose in 4 or they lose in 7, losing is losing. Most Valuable Loser should be the name of the award in the playoffs.
    If the Yankees win in 6 and A Rod has another good game, its all his. If it goes to game 7 and CC is dominant, it goes to him.
    If the Phils win, its all Utley because you know Howard hasn't done anything to help.

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