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    The fighter-scorer is as rare as the 40-goal scorer, and almost as valuable

    Gregory Campbell gives Maxim Lapierre the crazy eyes - Getty Images

    While the waiving of Colton Orr may not have signified the end of the pure fighter, it certainly signified the beginning of the end.

    If Orr can't stick in Toronto, where I wouldn't be shocked to learn that GM Brian Burke has a "truculence" stencil on the wall behind his desk, there aren't many places left for guys like him. But don't think Orr's dismissal marks the end of fighting or the end of toughness. Far from it -- it merely marks the shift. The pure fighter is the past.

    The fighter-scorer, however, is the future. He's also among the most coveted player types in hockey right now.

    Last year's Boston Bruins were the quintessential example of what can happen if the players providing your toughness are versatile. It wasn't just that Boston had guys that could drop the gloves -- it's that those guys were still plenty effective when they held onto their equipment.

    The Bruins had two players finish in double digits in fighting majors in 2010-11 -- Shawn Thornton and Gregory Campbell -- and both those players finished in double digits in goals as well. Thornton had 10 goals and 14 majors; Campbell had 13 and 11.

    Let me put into perspective how impressive this is: there were only seven players in the entire NHL that reached 10 goals and 10 majors in 2010-11, and Boston had two of them.

    The other five, if you're wondering, were Ryane Clowe (24 G, 12 MAJ), Brandon Prust (13 G, 18 MAJ), David Clarkson (12 G, 14 MAJ), Tim Jackman (10 G, 12 MAJ), and Steve Ott (12 G, 11 MAJ).

    David Clarkson - Getty ImagesAs we near the halfway point in the 2011-12 schedule, with most teams having played 41 games now, the numbers of players projected to reach the milestone is even lower.

    As of this writing, only four players have 5 goals and 5 fights: David Clarkson, with 15 goals and 6 majors, Wayne Simmonds, with 10 goals and 5 majors, 22-year-old Matt Martin, who has matched the 5 goals from his rookie season in 30 fewer games and has 6 majors to go along with that, and Derek Dorsett of the Columbus Blue Jackets. Dorsett has 7 goals and 10 fights already this season.

    There are a few other players that could reach 10/10 with strong second halves, as Gregory Campbell, Steve Downie, Steve Ott, Jordin Tootoo, Chris Neil, Maxim Lapierre and Ryane Clowe are all within striking distance. I doubt all of them will get there, but I wouldn't be surprised to see last year's total of seven repeated.

    Seven. Would you believe that it's rarer to post 10 goals and 10 fights than to score 30 goals? There were twenty-nine 30-goal-scorers last season. Heck, fighter-scorers are almost as rare as 40-goal scorers, of which there were five.

    And they're almost as vital to deep, successful teams.

    What the 2009-10 Chicago Blackhawks and the 2010-11 Boston Bruins have shown us is that there isn't room in a Stanley Cup-winning lineup for a player that can't take regular shifts. You need four complete lines that can score, as those teams boasted, and you simply can't waste spots on one-dimensional pugilists.

    Nowadays, if you want toughness (and you need toughness), you either get a guy who can fight and play, or you willfully dress a flaw. Last I checked, the team that wins is the team with the fewest flaws, so starting with a one-flaw handicap is hardly efficient.

    The fighter-scorer, however, very much is.

     

    74 comments

    • Roybss  •  4 months ago
      Best ever was Keith Tkachuck when he played in Winnipeg 93-94, 41 goals 81 points and 255 penalty minutes, or his 1st year in Phoenix with 52 goals and 86 points to go along with 228 penalty minutes.
      • patrick f 4 months ago
        CAM NEELY... END OF DISCUSSION
    • scott  •  Cheyenne, Wyoming  •  4 months ago
      Gordie Howe
      • Supkem 4 months ago
        I heard an interesting fact about G. Howe the other day. While The act of getting a fighting major, an assist and a goal all in the same game is named for him. He in fact only achieved that one time in his career.
    • qstick  •  Irvine, California  •  4 months ago
      Bob Probert may have been the perfect example of a guy who could net rubber and drop the gloves.
      Probert and Wendell Clark. Probert and Tie Domi. Probert and Stu Grimson. Probert and McSorley--some epic fisticuffs for all to see.
      Probert wasn't called one of the 'bruise brothers' for nothing. His then teammate Joey Kocur was another guy noted for punching opponents, Kocur was the other-half. Later on, those two squared off on more than one occasion.
      Tough, rugged, mean, nasty, yet skilled.

      There was a guy named Dan Maloney who was the best fighter in the NHL for awhile. He did it but wasn't an instigator most of the time. He too, could put the biscuit in the basket.
    • DonnyS  •  Methuen, Massachusetts  •  4 months ago
      Cam Neely
    • Allan Lee  •  Montreal, Canada  •  4 months ago
      I would not call Maxim Lapierre a scorrer-fighter. 1) He doesn't score goals, and 2) he sure in hell doesn't fight! He's got a big mouth, that's about it! If you call this fighting, the pretend fights he's had in is short career, my mother slaps harder! Maxim is a joke, and I'm so happy we got rid of him.
      AL
      • JJ 4 months ago
        Hey Allan... how is your team of midgets doing out there in Montreal?
      • m b 4 months ago
        good...cause we love him in vancouver! thanks for hating him!
      • Gretzky's Mullet 4 months ago
        So who is it with the gloves dropped in the photo there?
    • James D  •  Washington, District of Columbia  •  4 months ago
      Terry O'Reilly - over 80 points several times, team Captain, and one of the best fighters all-time.
    • Mystery  •  4 months ago
      Eric Lindros during his prime was a sight to behold.
    • Shamus  •  Buffalo, New York  •  4 months ago
      Clark Gillies,Terry O'reilly and Cam Neely
    • Jad S  •  4 months ago
      boston won the cup because they have the most power fowards in the game.they are hard to find probbly have a better chance finding a 40 goal scorer ;)
    • BuckG  •  Coram, New York  •  4 months ago
      There has always been policemen who also were skilled players. Orland Kurtenbach, Vic Hadfield, Steve Vickers, Clarke Gillies, and John Furgrson. True goons have always wore out their welcome.
    • Sweet Chinito  •  San Francisco, California  •  4 months ago
      i like asham, doesnt have a ton of goals, but has some soft hands/knack for goals in the playoffs. as well as celebrating a knockout with classless style
    • Yup  •  Philadelphia, Pennsylvania  •  4 months ago
      good article. I had never heard of the 10/10 stat, but it sounds like a great way to describe the key guys on a team, the guys you never hear about but you definitely know of if you watch em play. Stats really don't describe too much in hockey, so its nice to hear a cool benchmark for the guys who really define the character of team and the guys who seem to help dictate deep playoff runs.
      Id still like a concrete way to describe players like Manny Malholtra or like Mike Ricci back in the day. Guys who excel(ed) in providing grit and toughness but may not have the fighting majors stat to help describe the way they play(ed). You know, the pure hockey players
    • banzai  •  Camden, New Jersey  •  4 months ago
      Clarky has left the fighting to Cam and Boulton!!! He's still a chipper thou!!!
    • chuck d  •  Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania  •  4 months ago
      Bob Battleship Kelly, Dave Tiger Williams, Dave The Hammer Schultz
    • G  •  4 months ago
      We miss you Bob.
    • notafanofthepatriots  •  Los Angeles, California  •  4 months ago
      No mention that Ryane Clowe was the only 20+ goal, 10+ fighting major? And he hits, is great in the shootout, and is a good team leader. His only drawback is that he's slow. Clowe needs more appreciation, people!
    • A Yahoo! User  •  4 months ago
      I like fighting in hockey but not goons. If you cant play but only fight take up MMA or boxing. Goons are the biggest clowns in all of sports.
    • caddycash  •  Meriden, Connecticut  •  4 months ago
      Only 3 players in NHL history with 500 goals and 2,000 pim..........Pat Verbeek, Keith Tkachuk and Brendan Shanahan
    • Akai  •  Chicago, Illinois  •  4 months ago
      I'm a long time Hawks fan and was a fan of Proberts even when he was with the Wings. Probert and Primeau were monsters thank God the Wings don't have any guys like that anymore. We would be in trouble.
    • kirkymon  •  4 months ago
      I agree, but it's not only goal scoring forwards. Look at Matt Carkner in Ottawa. The guy came into the league as a one-dimensional tough guy, but with luck got a crack on the blue line (his natural position) and has proven his worth over the last 3 seasons as a regular third-pairing guy who can kill penalties and clear the front of the net. He can still drop 'em when he needs to, but that's just to serve as a warning to anyone that comes near his goalie.

      People talk about old time hockey and losing the tough guy. I think we're just coming back to old time hockey where guys could play, but also stick up for themselves and not have some hired goons do it for them. I call it the 'Gretzkyfication' of the league. ;)

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